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[netevilarch]

Hi All

I will be down the wall on Tuesday night as well.  I even have some brand new prussiks available......

Cefyn

[lithos]

that went pretty well i thought,

1 very important thing i did not mention or emphasie - when clipped in with your sling
DO NOT GO ABOVE THE BOLTS.  always stay hanging below them, falling from above the bolts
onto your sling is very very very bad !

hopefully all can run through it at home with rope through banisters ! the more you do it the easier it gets.

Peri, i could run through doing an abseil if we end up at the york wall on friday, sorry we ran out of time,
mis calcualted how long it would take.

for those who dont have (and want prusics) you need about 1m..1.25m of 5 or 6 mm cord.  costs  a bit less than quid a length i think.   Cef said he had some and ive got some as well, nevisports and leeds wall also sell it.

we didnt cover baling out. Basically gettign stuck half way and wanting to come down.  (too hard
starts raining, someone opens the chooclate etc) assuming no one is around to go up and rescue the gear
and you dont want to leave a krab....

Its pretty much the same as we did  but with the added complexity of only have a
single bolt hanger (like what you clip at the wall) to play with - hence very little space

1) make yourself safe on the bolt with your sling (so thats a quickdraw and a screwgate into the bolt!)
2) remove quickdraw to create space
3) clip in maillion/leaver biner/at a push prussic loop, into hanger
4) decide if you are to lower or abseil (for leaving tape/prussic MUST abseil)
5) go through the same procedure as before (make sure you cant drop the rope, untie/rethread, etc)

Make sure your belayer knows what you are doing, if THEY think you are abseiling + you think
you are lowering there maybe issues!!!!!

we can practice all this on the ground, at the house or wherever.more pratcice makes it easy,
but basically 'simple' and 'careful' are your watch words

[pebbles]

Hi rob

will need to pack friday evening as have friends turning up unexpectedly tomorrow and am climbing at leeds with helen james and andy tonight. I assume abing off a sports route is a similar routine - clip on securely to bolt (from below - see - I do read emails!) knot rope to harness as for lower off so as not to drop it, set up ab rope as usual - with prussic back up - making sure ends either reach the ground or are knotted if its a multi pitch.  I assume you have to pull through the end that is originally clipped  to release it from the bolts,(checking that in turn reaches the ground or is knotted) otherwise it obviously wont go thru the abseil device. I'll look up some stuff on the net to refresh myself on the set up. not too worried about the abseiling itself - have abbed in to a few routes, and when second unable to clean gear.

[netevilarch]

Hi All

I have serched the Internet and found some useful links that people may like to look at.

Bolts

 

http://www.safercliffs.org/code/photos.html  This link shows a collection of bad bolts that have been removed from Australian cliffs.

 

http://www.safercliffs.org/code/bolt_guide.html  This page shows the different types of bolt sand roughly how deep they are inserted into the rock.  We will most probably see some of these fixtures in Spain.

 

Abseiling

 

The following links show ways to back things up when you are abseiling.  I always use the back up below the belay device method.

 

http://www.climerware.com/rap2.htm  The first page shows the back up above the belay device.

 

http://www.chockstone.org/TechTips/RapBackup.htm  Comprehensive article showing many ways to back up a abseil or rappel.


Cefyn

[Simon C]

In case anyone's starting to panic about how complicated everything is, I managed several trips to Spain without knowing a lot of this stuff, and most of it you will probably never need to use anyway as you're unlikely to have to retreat off anything.

It's all worth knowing though I suppose

[lithos]

Hi rob
... I assume abing off a sports route is a similar routine  ....

indeed thats it in a nutshell nd what we did on the tower.

As simon says most likey wont have to do much/any of this but i think having a few basic steps
-like we covered yesterday with a flexible, careful approach will get you out of anything you might encounter.

If we are going to be doing big multipitch its unlikey that novices would be setting off alone

[TracyRuns]

Thanks for that Simon - I was starting to think I'd joined on the abseil trip....I have finally gotten round to purchasing a piece of tat for a prussik but that's as much prep as I have 

[lithos]

not at all tracy, virtually all of the crags are single pitch jolly low stress affairs but ive been reading the guide book
and it looks like the 'best crag' in the area is the huge  (wide) multipitch  (3..5) wall  with routes from 5, which
 will require multiple abseils (and ill bet you alot of more simon has his eyes on that route' !) a great day out and fun to boot - but proly only 1 or 2 days.

so its not all theoretical and obviously we wont let people get into situations they are uncomfortable with if we can help it !

none of it is difficult - it just takes care and calm .

[Simon C]

Yes indeed Leyla (or whatever it's called) is high on my list of must-dos!
Orihuela also has some multi pitch (there's a 3 star 4 pitch bolted grade 5 amongst other things) with (I think) an abseil descent.
And there are some really long routes on El Bosco (or something like that), something like 12 pitches, grade 4+(?) but trad, though with a walk-off descent.

But more than enough single pitch bolted stuff to keep everyone happy for the week if anyone doesn't fancy multi pitching.

[pebbles]

its leiva. looks like a lot of the routes on it are higher grade ones though.

[Simon C]

Yes it's mostly hard stuff, but there are enough easy routes for at least one visit.

[lithos]

worth reading the comments on rockfax.com  route databases, some of the grading is seen as interesting !

but lots of praise for some of the routes.

[Simon C]

I'm never sure how much notice to take of those databases these days, we did a route at Horseshoe for instance that was quite clearly easy grade 5, yet half the votes were for 5+.  But worth bearing in mind of course.
We've also got the local guides in which a lot of the grades are quite different, so it least we can pick and choose which ones we want to believe

[pebbles]

yeah I think its all very dependent on what happens to suit your own particular climbing strengths and preferences.
I, for example, find I am poor on routes biased towards strength, bottle or technical skill.

[lithos]

I, for example, find I am poor on routes biased towards strength, bottle or technical skill.

favouring ?

[netevilarch]

Getting people to spell and pronounce her name correctly !!!!

Cefyn or is it Kevin ?

[Simon C]

worth reading the comments on rockfax.com  route databases, some of the grading is seen as interesting !

Where's this then?  I've had a look but most of the comments/votes seem to agree with the grades.

I've not bothered looking at anything harder than 5+ mind you  

[pebbles]

favouring routes for unfit weak cowards with no technical skills!!!!!!!!! ;

[Simon C]

Andrew's got a book of easy rambles in the area, so make sure you pack your red socks...

[TracyRuns]

yes but pack a sleeping bag the last time Karen,Andrew & Annie decided to go for a walk in Spain we had to call the police and they were almost be-nighted 


dodgy grading gives those of us mediocrely skilled climbers an excuse